Otis
44 posts
Jul 25, 2007
10:00 AM
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Keith, Kelly, I wish I knew what I know now about Falcon nests, so that I could save other roller flyers a lot of anguish and good birds. I too have a nest about 2 miles away on top a University roof. My loses occur like you Keith on clear blue days when they elevate. I have to train and fly just before dark and misty, rainy overcast days limit the number of attacks. I only fly experienced survivors on good days before dusk with my fingers crossed. What I have been forced to look for are birds that survive, regroup quickly and
exhibit the courage to continue rolling after the danger has passed. It hasn't been easy and moving takes more than just looking for another place. I never thought I'd wish for only cooper attacks. LOl....it ain't funny. Otis
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1473 posts
Jul 25, 2007
2:22 PM
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Found this checking through my logs; I wonder if the NBRC's current inaction and inconsistent stance of its officers compared to the club press release is doing any of us any good: Click Here
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
Last Edited by on Jul 25, 2007 2:22 PM
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donb
10 posts
Jul 25, 2007
4:10 PM
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Guys, this looks pretty simple to me. Regardless of the situation thes guys are by law innocent until proven guilty and if that prooves to be the case then the by-laws would come into play as to member conduct. Unil then we need to stick together, defend our club and see what happens. No cause for resignations on anybodys part unless proven guilty in a court of law. Some folks just like to stirup controversy DB.
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RUDY..ZUPPPPP
97 posts
Jul 25, 2007
6:04 PM
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EXCELLENT COMMENT ..............
DON,,,,DONT STIR UP MANURE U WILL GET DIARHEA..
RUDY
Last Edited by on Jul 25, 2007 6:06 PM
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nicksiders
1931 posts
Jul 25, 2007
7:32 PM
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Rollerman,
Are you Duane Mitchell?
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Nick
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Ballrollers
812 posts
Jul 25, 2007
7:36 PM
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I don't know what to tell you, Tony. The negative forces coalescing against the hobby are just as significant from within as from outside the hobby. I'd recommend you bag this thread, but it's too late, now....They've got a little more ammo to discredit the hobby with. It's beyond me why a few guys refuse to use their brains a little before they shoot off their mouths. Go figure....
Cliff
You might want to monitor these threads a little closer, Tony, for the time being, since our hobby is, obviously, under a microscope.
Last Edited by on Jul 25, 2007 7:39 PM
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Missouri-Flyer
766 posts
Jul 25, 2007
7:48 PM
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Hmmm, ever heard of free speach Cliff, and all others who want to run off at the mouth about how those that feel that the right thing to do is for those at the top to VOLUNTARILY step down UNTIL the smoke clears, and things are back to normal. I for one believe it would do more good than bad for those that hold a calling in the NBRC that are tied up in this case to step aside and draw the pressure to themselves than to the club.
makes me wonder why some of you want the club to take the fall, versus the individuals...Go figure!
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Jerry
Home of "Whispering Wings Loft"
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1475 posts
Jul 25, 2007
9:22 PM
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Look people, there ARE TWO SIDES on this issue. Why does one side tell the other side (which by the way has a legitimate concern) to be quiet? From my perspective, if certain people step-down until trials are over and people are exonerated, then the club and its members benefit.
However, staying put possibly hurts our credibility and makes us out to be liars and a “ring” to those that are listening (FGWS, Animal rights and rescue groups and media). This is ALL happening in the first place because good people said nothing to somebody else that what they may be doing, might be or is wrong.
To be pressured by my peers to stay quiet and then if I do, then I too have no integrity. I said it before, we face an existential threat to our hobby and it’s the “secrecy” and the mentality that supports it which is the BIGGEST THREAT! PERIOD. Why people cannot understand this is BEYOND ME!
The discussion we are having is one that is needed as OHR touched everyone in some way (even I got hate emails and threats by falconers and scumbags by virtue of having this website).
The blog posted above mentions the inconsistency of the clubs press release and the entrenched position of certain officers and then linked to this discussion.
The position being promoted by the club itself could very well prove to be its undoing. Again, why others can’t see this is beyond me. But I guess it really isn’t too surprising, blind loyalty is not based on any reason or logic.
Thread stays.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
Last Edited by on Jul 25, 2007 9:25 PM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1478 posts
Jul 26, 2007
2:08 AM
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"EXCELLENT COMMENT ..............
DON,,,,DONT STIR UP MANURE U WILL GET DIARHEA..
RUDY"
Rudy, just what makes Dons comment excellent? I don't see it, please explain why you say this?
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
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Velo99
1233 posts
Jul 26, 2007
5:02 AM
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Ever consider what is best for the club and what is best for the accused could be two different issues entirely. I also believe that supporters on both sides of the issue truly believe they are looking out for the best interests of the club. The president stands accused. What ever is issued by the NBRC is considered biased simply by this fact.
As to the issue of by-laws. There is a line which refers to the integrity of the members of the EC. I seem to remember there was a similar review not long ago.
The conduct of members of the EC will be held to the highest standard. Slightly paraphrased, I am short on time,and can`t look it up but I read it recently.
It would seem to me that being involved in the action and bringing the negative attention(s) to the club would fall under this reference. The highest standard would be not to be even allegedly involved in such a situation.
The action would not call for an ouster but simply a suspension of duties for them to have the time neccessary to prepare a defense and concentrate on resolving the matters at hand. I sincerely believe this would result in closing the ranks of the club and rallying the support of more fanciers.
Now what I feel personally.
C`mon guys lighten up! It`s not like we`re kicking them to the curb and never speaking to them again. Simply making them a general member of the club instead of an officer. At that point the club can act as an unbiased entity and in turn rally around these fanciers and protect them as well as it can. It`s part of the public image game that`s necessary to regain any morsel of integrity we can muster.
yits
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V99
Flippin`The Bird!
http://www.bluedotloft.50megs.com
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Ballrollers
813 posts
Jul 26, 2007
5:52 AM
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Jerry, Tony, List,
I, too, believe in free speech. But there's a difference between free speech and being smart about what we say. I happen to agree with the position that the accused officers should have stepped down long ago for the good of the club. But all this ranting and raving on the internet sites is not gonna make that happen as long as their attorneys recommend against it because it will harm their cases. All these conversations airing our dirty laundry on public internet sites are doing is providing fodder for those forces outside the club who are looking to do us in, just as we see in the link. It's just not smart. Juan only has a few short months left, now. So what's the point?
Cliff
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Santandercol
1269 posts
Jul 26, 2007
6:14 AM
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Like Redneckhippie stated,"lighten up guys".There ain't nothing that's gonna do this hobby in.Stopping us all from flying and truly enjoying our birds would be like trying to stop a crack head from wanting more.Can't be done.
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Kelly
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1479 posts
Jul 26, 2007
6:37 AM
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"But all this ranting and raving on the internet sites is not gonna make that happen as long as their attorneys recommend against it because it will harm their cases. All these conversations airing our dirty laundry on public internet sites are doing is providing fodder for those forces outside the club who are looking to do us in, just as we see in the link. It's just not smart. Juan only has a few short months left, now. So what's the point?
Cliff"
Hey Cliff, first off, I want you to know I have admiration for your willingness and guts to even speak out about all this. Thank you!
Secondly, I for one am not ranting and raving on this issue. I am providing a reasonable point of view that is practical and easy to follow.
Third, as for airing "dirty laundry", the average club member has no idea what the heck is going on, we are being told to just be quiet like we are a bunch of lemmings. Since most do not want to pay a membership fee to this forum to go private, then all that is left is to discuss it in public.
Is some unofficial secrecy rule creating the very situation they say they do not want?
Fourth, so now an attorney runs the club in order to protect a client/s at the expense of mine and others good name?? Cliff, tell me you are kidding or that you just don't know all the facts...
However, if that is true, and the majority of the relevant club leadership does not see the problem of conflict of interest, then I will have no other choice but to announce publicly that I am quitting the NBRC in protest until such time as the current leadership is replaced or the accused parties step-down and are 100% exonerated.
I would invite a member of the NBRC executive committee to call me or email me and tell me if whether this is true or not.
My membership to the NBRC is due at the end of this month, I will wait til then to hear from someone before I renew.
I just need to know if an attorney has advised them to not step down, and so has probably led to all the "ranting and raving" on this and other lists.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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Last Edited by on Jul 26, 2007 6:40 AM
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George Ruiz
324 posts
Jul 26, 2007
7:11 AM
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Hi Tony
if you decide not to renew your membership thats your choice.
The N.B.R.C. is not charged with any crimes and is not considered a security threat group ,so I see no reason to abandon Ship.
Good Luck
George
Last Edited by on Jul 26, 2007 9:01 AM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1480 posts
Jul 26, 2007
7:18 AM
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No George, you're wrong, if an attorney now runs the club via what's best for HIS client and not the greater membership, then the club has left me.
You and how many others totally IGNORE the content of my previous posts as though they were never posted.
Do guys even think for yourselves anymore or do you let others do it for you? I am disgusted. Truly.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
Last Edited by on Jul 26, 2007 7:21 AM
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Ballrollers
815 posts
Jul 26, 2007
7:33 AM
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Tony,
Of course an attornery is not running the club. The EC is discussing and voting on items of business it is presented with, business as usual. However, I feel certain that Juan's attorney is recommending to Juan what he feels is best for Juan. It is up to the NBRC to decide whether it is in the NBRC's best interest to support its members and officers under indictment, or cut its losses. The NBRC is a much greater entity than a handful of frustrated guys on internet lists. There are two sides to the issue and to date, the EC has made the decision to support its members and officers.
The point I am making is that the dissention and negativity will effect no change. To date, I have not seen one item of business in front of the EC as a request or a recommendation from a member or an RD on this issue. If you are sincere about change, resigning in protest will accomplish nothing. Men who are sincere, need to quit hiding behind a computer, put their thoughts, requests and recommendations in writing, get some signatures, and submit it through their RD, or Juan to the Executive Committee. That takes a little more kahunas...a little more responsibility....but it is the only real way to make anything happen. As I said, representing ourselves on public forums as a disgruntled, rag tag band of men attacking and swearing at each other only confirms the distorted image of us they wish to portray. We need not play into their hands any more than we already have.
JMHO,
Cliff
Last Edited by on Jul 26, 2007 7:41 AM
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kcfirl
154 posts
Jul 26, 2007
8:12 AM
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Cliff,
you are right about following prescribed processes being the right way to voice our opinions. Uh-Oh, I think I agreed with both you and KGB in the space of 48 hours.
Something must be wrong with me. LOL
Sincerely,
Ken Firl
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Electric-man
440 posts
Jul 26, 2007
8:24 AM
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As I said, representing ourselves on public forums as a disgruntled, rag tag band of men attacking and swearing at each other only confirms the distorted image of us they wish to portray. We need not play into their hands any more than we already have.
I couldn't agree more!
I will do my best to not fall into this catagory again!
Val
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Ballrollers
817 posts
Jul 26, 2007
9:10 AM
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Ken,
I didn't, actually, think that was possible! LOL! But even I agree with the substance of his point! Imagine that! (It's just his methods and rhetoric that I am having problems with.) Thanks for the positive response.
Val,
Good move!
Cliff
Last Edited by on Jul 26, 2007 9:11 AM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1481 posts
Jul 26, 2007
9:11 AM
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No Cliff, its a group trying to make a correction to a ship going in a wrong direction...
Since my last post, I did receive a phone call and learned some very interesting things about the inner circle that I did not know by someone who is very close to the inner workings of the club and would know.
I will not be renewing my NBRC club membership. Good luck. I will leave this topic alone, I will go back and focus on raising and flying my rollers and helping my customers enjoy the hobby once more.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
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George Ruiz
325 posts
Jul 26, 2007
9:12 AM
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Tony I did not ignore your post .You seem to be upset that Juan and others dont resign or spend some of the clubs money on a public relations firm or disband the N.B.R.C. and devide the money in the books amongst it's members.
your post are almost sounding like a personel attack on the N.B.R.C. .
I just think that there is a better way to address your concerns as I am almost sure you are just trying to look out for the club.
Tony dont take this as a personel attack at you in any way
and in no way is my opinion the view of the N.B.R.C. or any others members of the club.
Thanks George
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1482 posts
Jul 26, 2007
9:21 AM
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Thanks for your comments George.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
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bman
337 posts
Jul 26, 2007
9:31 AM
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If you are unhappy with the direction of the club or the country or the PTA for that matter the way to change it is with your vote.If you quit you have no vote.Quitting is just quitting. WITH ALL DUE RESPECT.JMHO
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Ron
Borderline lofts
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1483 posts
Jul 26, 2007
9:33 AM
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Can you vote the bobs out? With Respect, Ron, I AM voting by not renewing my membership.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
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bman
338 posts
Jul 26, 2007
9:54 AM
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Tony,
I respect your decision but the BOPs will still be here regardless. I think you have a unique oppurtunity to be able to effect some change in the "status quo" that currently exists thru your ability to communicate and the advantage of this forum.Maybe everyone wants to see the NBRC go the way PRC or the IRC and the host of other clubs that fell by the way side due to internal unrest.
I have stayed out of these posts on purpose till now due to the fact it is way to easy to spout opinions via a key board that create rifts in organizations and friendships that are sometimes impossible to repair. I hope this is not one of those occasions. I wish you ALL the best.
I am headed for the "backyard"
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Ron
Borderline lofts
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1485 posts
Jul 26, 2007
10:23 AM
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Hey Ron, I am trying to effect change by responsibly posting and provide solutions to the bop concerns (3 Choices thread), I am also trying to get people to see that we need to maintain our integrity by calling for people to do the right thing.
Is the club flawed? Do we need a wholesale clean-out of the club leaders and vote in term limitations so that fresh faces and ideas can be heard from?
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
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Ballrollers
820 posts
Jul 26, 2007
11:58 AM
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The problem is in getting guys to fill their shoes, Tony. I hope you will reconsider your decision. We need guys like you on board in order to make the necessary changes. There are barriers, as you have learned, but the task is not insurmountable. Give it some time and think about it, first. Think about the potential impact on this list..on the hobby as far as you are concerned...on everything...
Cliff
Last Edited by on Jul 26, 2007 12:01 PM
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Spud
130 posts
Jul 26, 2007
1:56 PM
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I agree with Cliff (That's a first!) Bailing now is not the way to effect change. WE REALLY DO NEED EACH OTHER.
Spud
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Velo99
1234 posts
Jul 26, 2007
6:36 PM
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It is obvious to me that Juans lawyer is calling the shots on the NBRC EC or Juan would be out on his ass.
When is one man`s folly above the best interests of the club? This is exactly what is happening right in front of your eyes and it seems a large number of you are simply too blind to see it.
Cliff,
That has the be the biggest bunch of BS I have heard all day. Getting an issue in front of the EC via your RD is as big a joke as the leadership of this club. Turcotte is the only sane one.
How can it be business as usual on the EC with this huge cloud hanging over the club? The EC consideration is laughable from the action taken so far.
You guys let the club get punked by the media by not taking immediate action and asking Juan to resign. On Fox they said The president of the club was arrested and then issued this statement. The NBRC position statement was then portioned to the public.
If he was out,the statement would not have been made implying a "good ol` boy" network of redneck hawk killers by the USFWS. Their rep said "These guys think they are above the law." This is on international TV viewed by the WORLD. Why in Gods name would I want to pay dues to or belong to a corrupt bunch of hawk killers? I have NEVER killed or harassed a BOP period. Yet I have had to make changes in my program. That in itself leaves a sour taste in my mouth.
Now I see the club get sodomized on Fox News due to the "everyday business" of the EC. They are slamming the club not Juan. They always seem to make a point of pointing out the president was arrested and the club issued this statement. Juan`s name isn`t mentioned but Fox left NBRC on the caption for the entire time the piece was running. It made me ill. The choice is mine to leave but yours to convince me to stay.
Whatcha got?
ps Good thing I got custom bands from Tony this season.
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V99
Flippin`The Bird!
http://www.bluedotloft.50megs.com
Last Edited by on Jul 26, 2007 6:41 PM
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Missouri-Flyer
772 posts
Jul 26, 2007
6:57 PM
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Damn Kenny,
bad day at work?...LOL
The band comment made me laugh out loud!
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Jerry
Home of "Whispering Wings Loft"
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Velo99
1236 posts
Jul 26, 2007
7:03 PM
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Jer,
Just tired of watching the situation unfold and having the club slammed without so much as a whisper from the EC or anyone in power with the exception of Allen Turcotte. Cliff expressed his personal opinion here but evidently kept his lip zipped in the EC meetings.
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V99
Flippin`The Bird!
http://www.bluedotloft.50megs.com
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Gregg
112 posts
Jul 26, 2007
7:12 PM
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The above is not in chronological order so you will have to look it over carefully. Then I would suggest a ground swell of emails to the RD's to pressure Juan to resign and let Allen Turcotte step up and lead us out of the swamp. I am going to catch five kinds of hell for this(the above post) but I've been there before.
Gregg.
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Missouri-Flyer
773 posts
Jul 26, 2007
7:49 PM
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I hear ya Kenny,
I was the first to post my open opinion after this thread was started, and feel the same way as I did then. As I have stated, how can anyone see it any other way than the hobby is suffering while those accused are still at the top?..Makes no sense to me to bring the club name down..Maybe I am just an idiot, with backwards thinking.
Or,...never mind
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Jerry
Home of "Whispering Wings Loft"
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nicksiders
1939 posts
Jul 26, 2007
7:57 PM
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FIRE!!! Everybody out!!! FIRE!!! Everybody out!!!
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Nick
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Missouri-Flyer
774 posts
Jul 26, 2007
7:59 PM
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Nice work Greg!
Tho I have not baked myself with the readings of any statements from those accused, I still believe that for any club,group,clan,etc. to survive when the leader is in trouble, is for them to step aside, UNTIL all of the issues have passed, then if elected, resume their post.
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Jerry
Home of "Whispering Wings Loft"
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nicksiders
1940 posts
Jul 26, 2007
8:05 PM
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People rushing to the exits; nobody thinking, just rushing. Into the background above the noise and clammer from those rushing to the exits I hear the faint bleeting of sheep...........
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Nick
Last Edited by on Jul 26, 2007 8:12 PM
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Mongrel Lofts
305 posts
Jul 26, 2007
8:11 PM
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Jerry, Tony, List,
I, too, believe in free speech. But there's a difference between free speech and being smart about what we say. I happen to agree with the position that the accused officers should have stepped down long ago for the good of the club. But all this ranting and raving on the internet sites is not gonna make that happen as long as their attorneys recommend against it because it will harm their cases.
Cliff,
I have a question. Aren't you the same Cliff that wants to have the wild life guys and media at a question and answer at this NBRC convention? I'm pretty sure you are!! so I wouldn't be wondering if people are smart or not? Sheeeesh,, LOL KGB
Last Edited by on Jul 26, 2007 8:27 PM
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mkg
1 post
Jul 26, 2007
9:51 PM
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Good job guys (Edited By Moderator).Sounds like some guys on here have broken some laws them selfs and trying to make a smoke screen to hide in.I dont know Juan and have never met him. give him a brake.There is troble in the club but bashing on the web is not the way to fix things stop and and think about it.
Last Edited by on Jul 27, 2007 5:04 AM
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1489 posts
Jul 27, 2007
5:09 AM
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Hey MKG, what is your premise and how does it follow that you have determined that someone has broken laws here and is creating a smokescreen?
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
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pat66
10 posts
Jul 27, 2007
2:08 PM
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Someone slipped up,got caught,and is paying the price,why cant we support each other and help each other, I noticed on alot of sites if your not in the click you might as well forget any help for anything!I know when a new member asks me through E-Mail I Will give him anything in my power to help him, Heck I just gave a kit of Graham Fireballs away to help a guy get started,but it seems a majority of guys are in it for the ALMIGHTY DOLLAR,So maybe we all need to revamp our own desires to make a club work! As Grandma used to say IF YOU CANT SAY ANYTHING NICE,DON'T.
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Ballrollers
822 posts
Jul 27, 2007
2:18 PM
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KGB,
Actually, having representatives from the USFWS, the Falconry sport, Audobon, and qualified NBRC men on a panel to discuss these issues and establish lines of communication is a very intelligent concept. I dropped it because men go to the convention to have a good time and don't want to have to deal with these issues at such an event.
Cliff
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1503 posts
Jul 27, 2007
3:14 PM
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Who slipped up?
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
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Gregg
117 posts
Jul 27, 2007
6:25 PM
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Cliff,
Not to worry. They'll be there anyway, just won't announce themselves as such. Don't be surprised if some unwanted media types show up trying to get comments from those attending. Be careful who you talk to.
I was hoping that you would be the one person in the current administration that would give us some straight answers. And from Allen's comments about taking things private, looks like the powers got to him also.
It really is a shame. To ask the guys on this or any list to shut up is totally BS. If the NBRC continues with this type of "trust us" program, then I for one think that it is time for a total housecleaning. This club is for the members, if certain people think their well being is more important, then they need to move on and let someone else take over. That's as honest as I can be. I hope you realize that friends can disagree and still be friends.
Gregg.
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Tony Chavarria
Site Publisher
1513 posts
Jul 28, 2007
3:15 AM
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Hey Cliff, should have left that last paragraph out, you had me until I got to that part! LOL
Thanks for the post, it was enlightening to some extent. I can buy into some of what you just said (assuming it IS the position of the EC). Do you know why the club's positions you mentioned are not published in its most recent bulletin or did I miss it?
I think it is helpful if someone in an elected position that is under such scrutiny resigned at least temporarily until found not guilty of all charges and then resume his/her elected duties.
Be that as it may, the reform movement needs to happen and the candidate/s for president who promise to implement and promote its platform while in office will have my support and vote.
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FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
Check Out Our Pigeon Supply Store
Last Edited by on Jul 28, 2007 3:16 AM
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Ballrollers
826 posts
Jul 28, 2007
9:58 PM
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Tony,
I do not know for certain why this position has not been expressed to the members...I believe that it would have helped the situation immensely. Again...hindsight being 20/20. I would suspect that it has something to do with not wanting to create a wave of panic or dissention among members, which has occurred anyway......and something to do with the fact that the key people making that decision have been busy with the response via their own defense, the position statement, responding to the grand jury request for information, etc. depending on their situation.
As to a adopting a policy of temporary suspension of officers "under scrutiny", we would need a definition of "under scrutiny". Keeping this in perspective, I believe we are dealing with charges that have been reduced to misdimeanors. What if they were arrested for jay-walking and the media blew it all out of proportion and indicted the NBRC as promoting the violating of municipal laws? Would that qualify? Obviously, we are dealing with something momre serious in this situation, but as Brian said,it is the media distortion and our reaction to it, that is the real cuplprit here. What if it were an income tax issue....or a nasty divorce....all could be blown out of proportion by the media. Under what circumstances should the organization be deprived of its leadership by the media? Maybe all of them since the media hype is capable of diverting the attention of the officer from his responsibilities and duties. And it depends on the officer. Some are more resilient than others, when under the gun. I don't have a lot of answers, here, right off the cuff. But the point is that this is a complex issue with no simple answers and these types of things must all be crefully considered, and then agreed upon by the majority, not just a few of us, in order to change the way we do things.
Cliff
Last Edited by on Jul 28, 2007 10:12 PM
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maxspin
97 posts
Jul 29, 2007
6:40 AM
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Well said Cliff.
Keith
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Gregg
123 posts
Jul 29, 2007
1:20 PM
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Cliff,
What kind of answers do I want? Man I hate to bring this up, but a recent regional spat that had no business going to the EC, did. Both gentlemen stepped aside for the good of the club until the issue was resolved. It took time and money and effort to put on a national election that left a bad taste in the mouth of many members, irrespective of the outcome.
Here we have the president of the NBRC allegedly caught on tape, baited trap and all. I sent the man an email asking him to resign his position and allow someone to step forward and lead us out of the swamp. Someone who could have started that process in May. Yet here we are, still wondering what in the hell is going on because the officers of the NBRC want us to be good little soldiers and march quietly to "their" drumbeat. Guess what,they weren't convicted either, but both were gracious enough to step aside when asked. As it turned out, that was the right thing to do and I commend them for it. I just wish that some of our current leadership had that same gracious courtesy and respect for the members of this club rather than their own self interests at heart.
In your earlier post you mention that the position of the majority of the members of the EC is that the indicted members and officers are innocent until proven guilty. And they will support them until they have their day in court. (sentence deleted). Those were for charges that occurred during a NBRC "sanctioned" activity. Does the NBRC sanction hawk traps? I find the refusal by the president of the NBRC to step down to be a slap in the face of the law abiding citizens of the NBRC.
But he did say that he would bring my request to the EC.
The end result may be that they will want, probably already do, my resignation from the NBRC. But when someone tells me to be quiet, I damn sure wonder why. I will say it out loud again: If the USFWS finds the NBRC to be culpable inre a conspiracy to harm predatory birds, there will be no NBRC. I personally believe that someone should have been out there on the lists immediately after OHR came down, telling members to get legal, to stay legal, and teaching and educating them from day one. That would have set a positive forward moving action that the USFWS and any other interested parties would have to say, hey, they do know what is happening and they are doing the right thing.
On the contrary, We buried our heads in the sand. And I am not happy about it. You see, I really like this club and the idea of having to start over again is really a pain in the butt.
OK, I'll get off the soap box. I just put a big bulls-eye on my back. Feel free to take me apart. That is what this list is all about, free expression. This is just my two cents worth.
Gregg.
This below is a quote from another list of a respected roller fancier. I think he says it all. G.S.
"What all this is leading to is the need for very strong leadership in the upcoming election. We
don't need figurehead officers, we need leaders. I hope the members will consider the nominees
for their leadership abilities, rather than popularity. We can't go through two more years like a
rudderless ship at sea."
Last Edited by on Jul 30, 2007 2:28 PM
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