Alan Bliven
138 posts
May 10, 2005
9:45 AM
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Tony or anyone,
Please show me where results of the Polls are on the site. I can't seem to find them.
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Alan
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highroller
4 posts
May 10, 2005
11:06 AM
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Alan,
cick on POLL:Color Rollers? on the left side of the page. That will give the current poll as well as the archived ones.
Dan
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rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
287 posts
May 10, 2005
11:09 AM
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Hey Alan, here is link: SITE POLLS
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Alan Bliven
139 posts
May 10, 2005
5:24 PM
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Interesting results so far on the color issue. With 118 votes in, it's exactly dead even.
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Alan
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highroller
5 posts
May 10, 2005
6:57 PM
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Yeah,
But I wonder if there are really that many people casting votes or if a few are stuffing the ballot box on both sides of the question?????
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Alan Bliven
140 posts
May 10, 2005
8:56 PM
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I don't know how you can vote more than once unless you register multiple times and I'm not sure that's possible. All the other polls have at least 100 votes. One poll has 473 votes. Maybe there's so many votes because the polls have been up for a long time? I don't know how long the Color Roller poll has been up but some of them have been up for more than a year and a half. And this used to be a very very busy forum.
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Alan
Last Edited by Alan Bliven on May 10, 2005 8:58 PM
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highroller
6 posts
May 11, 2005
1:47 PM
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you're right Alan, it appears you can only vote once on the current poll. However I am quite certain I voted in some of the archived ones but they are all open to me now. Maybe cuz I voted before the lockout and re-opening.
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rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
289 posts
May 13, 2005
7:32 AM
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Hey fellas, a while back, I had purged some records and several current users were removed, as they re-register, they will be able to vote in all the polls again. I don’t think they will skew results all that much if at all as the purge was equal opportunity regardless of way they voted. Percentages should remain the same. LOL
Also, no one can stuff the ballot box so to speak as it would require registering hundreds of names and emails in a short period of time; I can assure you this has never happened. (I have never tried things with cookies turned off though, hmmmm)
Polls with larger responses can mean the poll has been up much longer than other polls and that some questions being asked elicit a larger response than others.
As for polls, does any one have any ideas for new polls that they would like to see voted on? Should any of the polls be removed or archived as being completed? Should a time limit be set for how long a poll is active to be voted on? I am interested in your thoughts on this. Thanks!
FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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Alan Bliven
141 posts
May 13, 2005
10:11 AM
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I believe the polls are very interesting. The reason I asked this question is I spoke to Rick Mee and invited him back in the forum but since he was out of town he didn't access. But the first thing he asked me about was the results of the polls. So, people are interested.
I'd like to see them saved somehow, either archived or left as they are. I don't see any problem with leaving them open as long as people can't stuff the boxes.
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Alan
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Rick Mee
18 posts
May 16, 2005
6:43 PM
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Alan, I am back from VA and am frantically trying to get ready for the move to TX in a few weeks. LOL Got a wild hair up my arse the other day, and put some of my stock birds back in the air.....just to see if they were really stockable after being on lock down for 3 months. Things are looking fairly good, even got them breaking again after their 3rd time out. As far as the poll questions being skewed, let me say this. I didn't happen upon this site until just a few months back, found it once before but didn't know about the message board. One night I was surfing around as we all do, and found this site, imagine my suprise when I saw my name on one of the polls. I was quite humbled to see my name being thrown around, so of course I started following this poll quite regularly, especially due to Don Oullette and I being friends, and being the top vote getters. LOL One night I noticed that one guy in particular was sitting at around 5 votes, then the next night was sitting at over 70 votes. Either this guy got all of his friends and relatives to vote for him, or figured out a way of repeatedly voting for himself. LOL Not that it really matters to me one way or the other if I get a vote or not, just saying that if a poll is to be conducted isn't there a way where we can ensure that a person only gets to vote once? Rick
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birdman
6 posts
May 16, 2005
9:51 PM
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Actually there is a way to vote more than once in the polls. I stumbled upon it this evening by accident and will notify Tony so that he can fix the glitch.
Russ
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rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
296 posts
May 17, 2005
6:49 AM
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Hey Rick, I am glad you found the site and got some fun from the polls. It is now my opinion that someone has found a way to stuff the ballot box (where is Jimmy Carter when you need him LOL)
Alan, I have a call in to my IT Dept to see if a way can be divised to enable one vote per visitor. I suggested to them using the visitors IP address, they will get back to me.
Thanks to everyone that pointed this out. Unless and until we can find a fix for this, read the poll results with a "grain of salt", remember these polls are not scientific but intended for enjoyment. Have fun! FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
299 posts
May 18, 2005
5:27 AM
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Hello All, apparently the way the poll feature programming is written, it allows for deleting cookies and voting more than 1 time. The IP solution has been tried but it comes with its own set of problems. Here is what my IT people had to say:
"Hi Tony,
Our visitor was correct that you can vote more than once by deleting your cookies. We did try limiting to one IP address before but this causes another problem as often hundreds of people can share the same IP address. In particular AOL does this so you could potentially only allow one person out of a whole region to vote.
Visitors will have to go by an honor system.
Emily"
So there you have it. We will have to use the honor system or do away with the polls all together.
I would like to use the honor system myself, what does anyone else think? Should the polls be eliminated or should we use the honor system and read the results with a grain of salt? FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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highroller
8 posts
May 18, 2005
8:48 AM
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Keep 'em going
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Bluesman
Pigeon Fancier
198 posts
May 18, 2005
5:37 PM
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Tony. Honor system.Keep them up. David
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Alan Bliven
146 posts
May 20, 2005
9:34 AM
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Isn't Thomas Hatcher out of Rollers? Hatcher from NM? Or am I thinking of someone else? I noticed he's listed in the poll "Who's number 1"
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Alan
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nicksiders
116 posts
May 20, 2005
8:29 PM
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Hatcher wrote a good book..................that is all I can say. I have never seen or heard about his own kit(s) flying and I have never seen his name on fly competition mentioned as a winner or a competitor.
I do have some Hatcher birds and they have performed just so-so, but that is because of my own training of them(I got sick at about the time they should have been flying). I have just started to work them again and haven't had them working that long.
As far as writing a good book......I think there are a lot of breeders that have the creativity and intellegence to write a good book as well. They have not elected to do so.
I would not put him on the same level as Rick or Don.
Everybody grew up in neiborhoods or communities that have thier own champion breeders and for some reason or another these champion breeders did not obtain the notoriety that others have. It may be the lack of just one championship or some political stuff that keeps thier name from being in front of us. My champion in my community when growing up was and is Bob Hord. I see his name now and then (sometimes with picture) but, I seldom hear anyone giving praises that a champion breeder should be getting. Currently I live in the same community as Joe Urbon and he is a champion breeder who few of us talk about. Maybe one big championship will put his name in front of us.
I guess what I am saying is reputation is sometimes undeserving both in high praise and no praise at all.
We all have our champions.
Thanks,Nick
Last Edited by nicksiders on May 20, 2005 8:34 PM
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Leo
Member
26 posts
May 22, 2005
10:21 AM
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Nick, why would Tom Hatcher have to be any kind of contender in any contest, for him to have good birds????You compared him with two other guys???? LET ME tell you, these two guys would give their loft away, just for one pr of Toms good stuff, I am shure you know , a guy dont sell or give away his top birds, Only a couple fanciers, have his GOOD stuff,Ive seen 8 out of 8 stocked ...out of one pr.Dont ever sell Tom Hatcher short....LEO....P.S. I say this with good intensions.
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Alan Bliven
151 posts
May 22, 2005
11:29 AM
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Interesting but no one answered my question...Is Thomas Hatcher out of Rollers? Tom Hatcher from NM? Or am I thinking of someone else? A friend of mine from here in Tucson said he went over there and bought him out... even all his kit boxes.
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Alan
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motherlodelofts
2 posts
May 22, 2005
11:32 AM
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Because it is a "prooving ground" Leo, talk is cheap, the fact is Hatcher has sold out "many" time's , he wrote a couple of books and sold a lot of birds, and that is about it.
As for , Don O and Rick Mee trading in thier lofts for his birds, or any of us with established lofts,all I can ask is this "What color is the sky in your world" ???????????? What a huge step BACKWARDS that would be.
P.S. Plona is behind one of Dons main line's, the other line goes back to Howard McCaully via Sparks , just branches off of the same tree.
Yes one in the same Allan
Last Edited by motherlodelofts on May 22, 2005 11:58 AM
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Ballrollers
5 posts
May 23, 2005
6:34 PM
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Well, I do see your point, Leo. On another list some guys were trashing Dave Henderson and Kowalski's birds. Though they admitted that these guys have contributed much to the hobby in writing articles and books, by producing quality birds that are being used by other guys for competing, yet they "heard" through the grapevine that their birds couldn't cut the mustard because the guys don't compete. That really ticks me off! Buy the birds, raise a few, fly them out....then maybe you have earned the right to diss the guy and his birds. But this, "I've heard....." crap is dirty pool. There are other measures of a man's contribution and the quality of his birds other than competitions. Winning certainly helps guarantee the worth of the family and the breeder, but even then it may not. People want to believe what they want to believe, and not always the facts....Cliff
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motherlodelofts
10 posts
May 23, 2005
10:05 PM
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Cliff both do compete
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Ballrollers
10 posts
May 24, 2005
12:36 PM
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So those guys were really off base, then. Or maybe their point was that their criticism of the families is well-deserved since consistent wins are not being posted. I still have a problem with basing an evaluation of a guy's birds, strictly on his wins. After all, there are only two winners each year! And there are certainly a number of good families that don't win for one reason or another. Cliff
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Leo
Member
30 posts
May 24, 2005
1:36 PM
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Now you are saying there are good familys that dont win for one reason or another....HURRRRRRRAY So what is a guy to do?????? enter . THE COMPITION ROLLER...they are on the way...you guys think not, I think the roller will change..except for the"A" breeders....LEO
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motherlodelofts
12 posts
May 24, 2005
1:48 PM
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Cliff you are right, you can't base it on wins , But what you can see is a pattern of consistancy as far as placings on the upper end, another indicator is the qaulity multipliers and compareing with others in the region or better yet the finals.
Judges are also a mouth piece as far as what they see around the country , not all teams are going to "smoke" on fly day, in other words "word" of good birds gets around.
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motherlodelofts
13 posts
May 24, 2005
1:49 PM
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Leo how do you think that they change ? what is a competition roller ?
Last Edited by motherlodelofts on May 24, 2005 1:51 PM
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Leo
Member
31 posts
May 24, 2005
1:53 PM
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I heard Henderson had great birds????JUST HEARD...? AS for Kowalski, he acquired the very best fron Stan P.THE DINAMO FAMILY, he eventually sold out for racing pigeons, THE last i heard he was back into rollers,He seems to be "LOW KEYED"???this time around...LEO
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motherlodelofts
14 posts
May 24, 2005
2:12 PM
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Leo I think that Kowalaski has did a little regional judging recently , Dave H lives up North, I've never seen his birds but have seen Joe Urbons which go back the same way and they are very good friends, they are nice fast tight spinners
Last Edited by motherlodelofts on May 24, 2005 2:16 PM
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Leo
Member
32 posts
May 24, 2005
2:54 PM
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Scott, A comp roller is in the making,,,so to speak...human nature a competative nature is all it takes, the thought of winning twice in a row, will DRIVE.. the end result...IT may take a butterfly wing action? Any no. of things,I heard you can get a 3 mo. old kit to spin together All spinning,YOU fly a slow flying kit of tumblers below them, The idea is to get the rollers to fly as slow as possible, this being done they perform much younger and together,??? could this work??? a new comp roller??? Thanks for the info on Kowalski,an Dave, That 11228 cock that Kkowalski got from Stan, sold for $450.00 at 14 yrs old and only fertiled 2 eggs OUCH,,,,...LEO
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motherlodelofts
15 posts
May 24, 2005
5:39 PM
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Leo I can assure that there is no such animal as a "Competition Roller " I never heard of flying a kit of tumblers under a team of rollers to get butterfly wing beat or to get birds coming in early at 3 mo.
I can get the butterfly wingbeat out of my birds with wheat and by beating them down to far.
What you will see is loose rolling for the most part with my birds in this condition , it is certainly nothing that I try to do !!!!
Some families are bred to fly slower also.
As for birds that come in hard at 3 mo., it is genetic and basicly "hot" families will come in hot and early such as this , that is not the type of bird I care for myself as they can be a real pain in the ass.
There is nothing that can surpass a bird that can give you the speed and qaulity of a top notch bird , and like you said in a earlier post, once you've seen it nothing else matters, oh except they better kit like glue also LOL
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spinnerpigeon
5 posts
May 24, 2005
6:17 PM
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Is anyone here flying striaght Kowalski birds??
Caleb
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birdman
11 posts
May 24, 2005
9:19 PM
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Caleb,
I've got a 14 year old cock whos grandfather on his sire's side was #18736,and the grandfather on the dams side is #3881, both were some of the original Dynamo birds. The blood of all the great Dynamo birds such as 11315, 11228, 18736, 18345, 3881, 3822 etc... are behind these birds.I also have one of his best sons and 2 of his granddaughters. About six years ago I got all but these 4 birds stolen and have loaned them out for the past few years and have been testing a couple different families in between. So far the old cock hasn't filled eggs this year but I still have hope for him. He's known as the old 'Mooneyed Cock'. The late Paul Bradford handled this cock and really liked him and made a comment that this cock had 'eyesign' that went back to the pyramids (whatever that means ?). He produced 3 really outstanding birds for me that were nearly perfect spinners. The recessive reds from him were almost always very hot, high velocity birds, but for some odd reason any blue bar from him was always stiff and would seldom roll more than 5'. I probably should have built the family back up after they got stolen but it really took the wind out of my sail to lose the majority of the loft that I spent 7 years building. If I can get a few youngsters from him this year maybe I can send you one or two to fly out before he goes dry for good. He was flown and stocked from the air and would roll from 10-50' in good style.
Russ
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spinnerpigeon
6 posts
May 25, 2005
5:26 AM
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Thanks for the info Russ! My e-mail is spinnerpigeon@hotmail.com
Caleb
Last Edited by spinnerpigeon on May 25, 2005 9:08 AM
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Leo
Member
33 posts
May 26, 2005
8:57 AM
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Russ, do you have any information on a son of 11228 he is prc.75..18710.?I have him 4 times on a pedigree, so 11228 being his father, is also listed 4 times,18710 was a bronze, he is refered to as the 750 cock, this was the amount he sold for, i think Hatcher owned him at the time. 18710 was 25 to 40 ft, he produced a bronze cock ..81..504 he too was 25 to 40 ft. '504' is in many of my birds, I just thought you could add a little more info, if you had any, 11315 was a full bro to 11228..Truly great Rollers...LEO
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birdman
14 posts
May 26, 2005
11:13 AM
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Leo,
I will look through my paperwork when I get home.
Russ
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birdman
17 posts
May 26, 2005
7:35 PM
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Leo, I didn't have #504 in any of my pedigrees but have a few birds with 18710 a few generations back. One thing is for sure, Plona bred some outstanding birds that others have benefited from for several generations.
Russ
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Leo
Member
42 posts
May 28, 2005
8:07 AM
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Russ, I owned # 504.. most of his life,he PRODUCED...thats what CHAMPIONS do..he was 14.. and died here, hope you have a good yr...LEO
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birdman
18 posts
May 28, 2005
8:22 PM
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Thanks Leo. I just got an Email from my friend with the Sparkes pigeons that you were interested in and will Email you privately about what he told me about his birds.
Russ
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