AD3
24 posts
Sep 06, 2004
10:36 PM
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Hi everyone. Is that what you call rollers that go from doing very little to a lot the next day ? I was given a pigeon (squeeker) by a friend of mine. The bloodline is known to be a bit "hot" and he was testing a new mating schema. I started flying this youngster about 3 weeks ago. I noticed something odd last week; this pigeon was already turning over. The rest of the young I bred out were only "tail riding". Today this bird was doing about 40 feet and very fast. I couldn't believe it, it was rolling like an adult and it just finished squeeking, but I can tell it was trying to get out of the roll towards the end of its display and showing little control. I think it bumped somewhere or something as I lost sight of it. Came back about 1 hour after the kit landed with no obvious injury but very nervous looking. Best thing to do I thought was let it cull itself. An alternative would be to keep it in for some time and count on luck to snap it out of this behavior. Your thoughts on "one day/night wonders?
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Last Edited by AD3 on Sep 06, 2004 10:38 PM
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rollerpigeon
Site Moderator
167 posts
Sep 07, 2004
5:46 AM
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AD3, I don't have much hope for it lasting much longer. You could try not flying for a week or so and hope its mental development catches up with its physical development.
When you do this, also give it a little more to eat. I have taken hot hens that were doing this and have had some varying degrees of success. Mostly it seems this type simply don't make it back one day...
Until it rolls down or actually upsets the kits normal development, keep flying it. FLY ON! Tony Chavarria
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fhtfire
49 posts
Sep 07, 2004
8:38 AM
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Hey AD3,
Man I had a little hen doing that too. It was a little black hen. She was doing little flips one day and then BAM 20-30footers and fast. She was fine for about a month. Showed a lot of control...never bumped...will roll deep when high and then shorten up when lower. Then one day...she rolled down and it was a thud and that was it. She was into the molt bigtime...so that may have played into it. I never thought of feeding her up because she showed so much control. So she bit the dust as quick as the roll came in...day/night. For a while I thought I had a true champion...LOL! Just keep flying it...if it becomes a lawn dart...then it was meant to be...but give it a little more protein..feed it up to see if it can get a handle on the roll.
Paul
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AD3
25 posts
Sep 07, 2004
10:36 AM
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Thanks for the reply Tony and Paul. I am going to hold it in for a week or two, feed it plenty of feed and then try to fly. If the bird is the same, let's hope it culls itself but before that let it display a great roll for the last time! :o) I have yet to breed a bird that is similar to this one and I hope I don't speak to soon. It's sad to have to remove this bird and perhaps know that next time he flies it may very well be the last time it does so.
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Last Edited by AD3 on Sep 07, 2004 10:43 AM
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
224 posts
Sep 07, 2004
11:59 AM
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AD, I can tell you from experience, when dealing with the early hot families, particularly the ones labeled as the early wonders, you have to keep them fed up, and I don't mean a little extra, I mean FED UP! Basically once they start rolling, gotta give them damn near as much as they want to eat, otherwise they won't make it. Some need a break for a week once in a while along with some feeding up. Depends on their work rate.
Brian.
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Thor
25 posts
Sep 07, 2004
9:07 PM
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Hi AD3,
This is a normal pratice in my line of birds. One day they can be flipping and the next release (10 min. or the next day/days)... wham, 15-30 footers. It's just something within some lines. If this is normal in the family, then it should stablize and become a dependable Roller if not a champion. If not, usually it will become a roll down. The key is, if the family is cultivated around such birds or not.
Let me share you a story that blew my mind this year. As I was flying the late rounds from last year, I noticed that one bird didn't trap in. While looking for it around the house (because I last seen the kit flying in that direction before the kit acted wierd), I noticed that there was a pigeon on the roof of the house. Yep, it was the missing kit bird. I expected to find a pile of feathers but there stood the missing kit bird. Anywho, as I gave the feed call (whistling) it took to the sky and ripped a fast 20 foot roll almost bumping before stopping himself short of the ground and glided in to trap. What was so amazing about this was before the previous 2 releases that day, he was only a constant flipper (those that would flip every other sec.). Since I needed to get the birds to come into the roll, after every trap, I would let the kit birds rest 10 to 20 minutes before kicking them right back out. As I stated, the previous 2 release, this bird was only flipping. 10 minutes after trapping in, it was kicked back out and wham 20 footers.
I have heard of really young birds rolling down on their first flight from veterens (altho I just pushed it off as being B.S.). I didn't believe that rumor until a buddy of mine had a similar case this year. After taking flight for the third time, he had a squeeker come all the way down. This bird start tail riding on his first flight. The second time he took to the air, he was flipping. The last time, all the way down.
Funny how we see something new everyday. Live and learn I suppose.
Give that bird a well needed rest and kick it back up. Let him tell you if he is worthy or not.
Flying them hard,
Thor
P.S. I only fly undeveloped birds hard when I need them to come into the roll.
P.S.S. Did that bird crawl the sky when coming out of the roll? Usually a bird which has no control will show some crawling foot movements as they come out of the roll.
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AD3
26 posts
Sep 08, 2004
9:04 PM
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Thanks for the response Brian and Thor. You are right about it depending on the family. This particular family of birds my friend works with is hot. Too hot! He and I discuss this frequently and as a matter of fact, he is getting rid of the majority of these pairs. The parents of this particular bird we thought would yield offspring with more control since both the parents were flown out and average about 30 feet each and stable. They both though, come from "hot" parents. This bird had just finished squeeking.
One note: I notice this pigeon came back a bit different. Not sure if it is temperment but it seems high on speed when I let it out and it shows signs/gestures of restlessness or nervousness. The eyes look a bit odd too, wide open and "crazy looking". Looks like a hot bird now to me. Perhaps it has to do with the fact that it may have bumped couple days ago. Not sure. Your thoughts.
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fhtfire
51 posts
Sep 08, 2004
9:42 PM
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AD,
That is so funny that you brought up the "crazy look" in the eye. A friend of mine Bill Crider and myself were just talking about that. We noticed some birds that he got from a breeder that we sort of characterized as "Spaced Out" looking eyes...like what a human would look like if they were drugged up...sort of out there..looking through you! These birds that he has are real hot too. I am wonderinf if that spaced out look is something to look att. The eyes are really wide open and kind of bright...like....."did you see the size of that cocka doodle god damn doo! You see the size of that chicken!"(young guns the movie...when they took the shrooms) That is it...just funny that I was just discussing the crazy eye with someone else!
Paul
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AD3
27 posts
Sep 08, 2004
9:55 PM
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I will take a closer look at it tomorrow Scott. I think you are correct. And Paul ..LOL.. funny stuff. "Spaced Out" is also on the list when describing this pigeons "look".
The pigeon's eyes are bright and don't even have much color in them because he is so young. They seem wide open, like if he is going nuts. Exactly how you described it. A "Holy Sh*&^, did you see that!?" look. Today I let him go and noticed those things. Poor bird, before this birds I didn't really believe a bird can rolldown so young. It's something we should never breed from or for.
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J_Star
10 posts
Sep 16, 2004
1:10 PM
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To correct this problem cut down on oily seeds. Observe what is that bird is eating when you feed them. If you are feeding your birds a wild bird mix with parakeet seeds, then it is time to change your feed all together. You need at leats 12% protein. After you do that, give it about a week and you can see the difference. By the way, when was the last time you de-wormed your birds. Worms causes the bird to have soar wing joints and rob them of their vitemins and minerals. That could affect their judjment to come out of the roll and affect their flying patern and habits.
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AD3
31 posts
Sep 16, 2004
9:21 PM
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Hello J_Star and thank you for the post. I don't think feed is what made this bird do this J_Star. Matter of fact, I don't think feed can make any bird do what my bird did unless the proceeding is true. The impulse must be in the bird to begin with. I do believe that feeding the bird "up" as they say, may help the bird gather the strength needed to overcome the impulse until it becomes mentally capabable of controlling itself.
I don't feed my birds wild mix or parekeet seeds. I have a question though regarding this: Why would anyone solely feed wild bird seed or parakeet feed to rollers? Perhaps as a treat ? Sounds a bit obsurd to me if you feed wild bird mix or parekeet seed without any other feed. Cheers!
***PS: Update on the bird: It has gained weight, and I am starting to toss it up when the kit is landing. Looks like I will be able get him up for a bit. Not sure how good or bad it will be. It was doing 2-3 flips every other second which is always a bad sign.
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Last Edited by AD3 on Sep 16, 2004 9:25 PM
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