Slobberknocker
Guest
Aug 27, 2004
2:09 PM
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Boy, some guys can really get their hackles up!! Probably the best thing to do instead of going back and forth with things, is to just have Tony set up a FAQ page and do away with this type of open forum? When you have an open forum such as this, it is open to anyone and everyone who can use a keyboard and they will type what they want. Good debate is one thing, but some of these postings have really gotten out of hand.
Anon who is talking about a lawsiut, you are out of luck I'm afraid. You would have to prove damages. Sorry.
Steve, with all due respect, what good is it going to do to talk to Jay about this? He doesn't need the stress and, I am sure, you don't either. These posts are nothin illegal anyway regardless of how nasty or "dumb" they may be. When you post things on an open forum, especially a hotly debated topis such as what has been presented as of late, you leave yourself open to anything. I am doing it now.
I am registered here and am not afraid to post my real name. I have not gotten in the middle of this as I know where it leads. My website has been mentiond on a couple earlier posts so you all knwo which side I stand on. Please do not continue the debate from this post. Everyone here has their own way of doing things and their own personal favorite kinds of Pigeons. It doesn't make them any less of a Pigeon fancier. Personally, I respect everyone regardless of their goals with their birds.
It seems that with the higher costs of life and more gadgets and gizmos our there for toys, it is hard enough to find new people who want to raise Pigeons. Most think they are all dirty rats with wings. we should all be able to get along and respect each others' likes and opinions without getting into a heated debate. Aren't there enough negative things in life as it is?
If you agree with me, please reply to this post. Maybe this can be turned around into something positive yet....
Bob McGuan -- Slobberknocker Lofts
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Slobberknocker
Guest
Aug 27, 2004
2:14 PM
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BTW.....I will say, without hesitation, that I truly respect Scott and Brian for their thoughs and ideas. They are much less abrasive than some Anons on here.
Phantom, you're my man and voice of reason as you well know.
David S., you are probably the finest Pigeon man I have ever had the blessing of knowing.
Although they may or may not read this, Jay Yandle and James Turner also have my utmost respect. I have birds in my loft from both of these guys and they have really moved my quality up.
Steve, Glenn, Tony, you guys also have my respect. I don't know any of you personally, but you can't be all bad if you raise Rollers.
Bob McGuan
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Glenn
Guest
Aug 27, 2004
2:16 PM
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Well Said.........Glenn
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Mother lode lofts
127 posts
Aug 27, 2004
2:25 PM
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it's like the voice of reason from above LOL. Very good post Bob and you have my repect no doubt.
Scott Campbell
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Bluesman
36 posts
Aug 27, 2004
2:44 PM
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I agree and Thanks for the Kind words.David S.
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
193 posts
Aug 27, 2004
3:10 PM
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Well said Bob and thanks for the compliment. Rational minds do think alike.
Brian.
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Phantom1
10 posts
Aug 27, 2004
5:06 PM
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Great post Bob! Thanks for your kind words also. You are today, and always have been a great friend and an excellent reference point for me. I truly look foward to getting to know all of you more through our new found respect for each other. Which, by the way, I honestly do have. Scott, Brian, and the many others - thanks for what you do also. NOW - Let's Play Pigeons!!!!!
Yours in the hobby and sport,
Eric Stephens
Last Edited by Phantom1 on Aug 27, 2004 5:08 PM
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fhtfire
42 posts
Aug 27, 2004
5:57 PM
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Bob,
Great post. As you can see in some of my posts..that I like debate and I like to read debate...but I do not like when people get personal. After talking with you on the phone and in e-mails...I felt that I would like to try some of your birds and that is why I puchased the birds from you...They are good birds (Black, Black baldies) Not a rare color LOL! But like I told you in our e-mails...if the birds prove it in the air I will spread the word!
This is a great site and I have learned so much from the people on this site. When there is an issue or a question I get answers...that is all I need as a new flier. This debate will go on forever! Just like if you ask...is a ford is better then a chevy LOL! I talked to Scott today..I was at his house watching his birds fly and getting some pointers...and he sent me home with a nice pair of birds. He even said that if you get excited wondering what color will pop out of a pair...the more power to you..do what you enjoy. Pigeons is what it is all about. Raising pigeons. If you love pigeons that is all that counts. Scott like myself and other fanciers just do not want someone selling birds to a new person that wants to compete and get some quality rollers and end up getting a buch of garbage. That happened to me already and it is not a good feeling. I got some birds off the internet and they did not roll good and neither did the offspring...but I was assured that they were top notch rollers and lost my a$$. I was really frustrated. That is all it is about...being straight forward and not raising birds for the love of money. I respect you and your site...because you are straight up...you explain what you are doing and what you goals are...when you sell a bird you state that it is a proven breeder...or a unproven bird. Nobody is forced to buy from your site. After talking with you and dealing with you I respect you. You went out of your way in just getting the birds to me. I just wish that everyone was as up front and straight forward as you. You hide nothing and expain yourself and your goals on your site. Again great post!
Paul
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Slobberknocker
Guest
Aug 27, 2004
6:40 PM
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Thank you guys for replying to my first post here. I will let you all know that I have had Pigeons since my dad died when I was 12. I am 31 now. I have always had and always will have Rollers, but it has been just in the last 5 or 6 years that I have really paid attention to quality and where my birds come from so I know how most of you feel having been sold junk as good birds.
When it comes to the color debate, I will not likely enter into the debate. I can see very strong and compelling points from both sides and I say we just leave it at that. There is no right or wrong in that debate. It is just like the Ford/Chevy thing Paul mentioned.
I think this forum can be a very positive tool for both the newcomer on up to the experienced competition flier as long as we don't all let the debates get out of hand. Maybe Tony could go through and clean up all the Anon posts that were really off the subject so as not to discourage any newcomer to this site. It might also be a good idea to make people register and have usernames to post here. No more Anons that way. Just a thought.
In closing, please keep this going. I am going feel really bad if Brian's "Controvery sells" topic gets more posts!! LOL Let's keep the positive coming and not dwell on the negatives. I sincerely hope I can get to know some of you better through this forum and that we can maintain mutual respect and build friendships.
Thank you again guys,
Bob
PS....How can I get in touch with Scott one on one? You cam email me at mcguan@charter.net.
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Mother lode lofts
134 posts
Aug 27, 2004
6:48 PM
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Bob my E-mail is motherlodelofts@netzero.com Bob drop me an email with your phone number and I'll give you a call.
Scott Campbell
P.S. I did just post to that thread LOL but with all that went on there I hope that it was'nt conscrued as a slam post as I'm sure many are jumpy at this point and the post is meant as an informational post on a kit competition.
Last Edited by Mother lode lofts on Aug 27, 2004 6:52 PM
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
195 posts
Aug 27, 2004
8:13 PM
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Hey Bob, just curious if you have ever tried/succeeded at producing an open pattern indigo blue check dilute-reduced? I thought about breeding for one next year in my Wests since I have them in those colors already, just not one of that combination. Several of us West guys have jostled the idea of what it would look like around, but none of us have done it. Just curious if you had and what the result visually was. I have diluted and reduced the indigos, but not together and not in open pattern check. Saw an American Roller at the Birmingham Nats this past year that was open pattern dilute indigo check. An unbelievably beautiful looking color. Thought something similar with combined with reduced would look kind of cool..on my show Wests only of course...lol.
Brian.
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Slobberknocker
Guest
Aug 28, 2004
6:42 AM
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Brian,
Would it be possible to answer your question through emial or would you rather use this forum? If you want to go through email, send me one at mcguan@charter.net. Otherwise let me know to post it here.
Bob
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Phantom1
12 posts
Aug 28, 2004
10:14 AM
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Brian,
I somehow raised a Reduced Indigo Grizzle Roller last year. The expression of it was something unique indeed. I myself am really trying to get Dilute Indigo as I don't think that I've seen a prettier bird. Of course, the base color alone is enough to make you stare! So I thought about trying to get a Dilute Indigo Barless. I bet some would call that yellow LOL!
Take care,
Eric
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MCCORMICKLOFTS
200 posts
Aug 28, 2004
11:33 AM
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Actually Eric they would probably call that a silver self as it would be free of bar on both the sheild and tail. A barless indigo bar would be pretty much just a straight blue self. If you diluted an indigo velvet (closed pattern) the bird would definitely appear yellow self like except for the silver flanks.
Bob, I sure will.
Brian.
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Phantom1
13 posts
Aug 28, 2004
12:00 PM
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Brian,
Good point. Of course I was just being sarcastic. I actually raised a Barless Blue Indigo this year. Looks like a Barless Blue minus the tail bair. Bob has some good examples of Dilute Indigo on his Color Chart. I love the way the dilute factor effects Indigo on Blue and on Red. You almost get that "reduced" effect to the chest and tail. Making that barless would be a pretty bird I think.
Eric
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